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geoag02 All-Star Author Dallas Posts:843 Points:177,970 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 27, 2011 9:55:14 AM Ignore geoag02 Report Abuse Of all the agricultural products that can be turned into fuel, why the focus on corn ethanol. It seams to me that soybean oil would have a much higher energy output per acre than corn ethanol and not require as much refining either. There are several other plant oils that would probably achieve similar results. If we really want to use ethanol why not use the cellulose from sugar cane that is normally thrown away as the raw material - that's what Brazil does.

geoag02

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Dallas

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Message Posted: Mar 27, 2011 9:55:14 AM

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Of all the agricultural products that can be turned into fuel, why the focus on corn ethanol. It seams to me that soybean oil would have a much higher energy output per acre than corn ethanol and not require as much refining either. There are several other plant oils that would probably achieve similar results. If we really want to use ethanol why not use the cellulose from sugar cane that is normally thrown away as the raw material - that's what Brazil does.

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goldseeker Champion Author West Virginia Posts:19,755 Points:2,746,515 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 10, 2011 12:38:47 AM Ignore goldseeker Report Abuse "If we really want to use ethanol why not use the cellulose from sugar cane that is normally thrown away as the raw material - that's what Brazil does." Did you know that we were already making cellulosic ethanol from sugar cane bagasse? Also, just how many states can we grow sugar cane in?
SophiaCA Champion Author San Jose Posts:1,727 Points:283,635 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Jul 9, 2011 11:25:59 AM Ignore SophiaCA Report Abuse sugar cane
cyclej Champion Author Dallas Posts:2,800 Points:188,690 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Jul 8, 2011 9:39:06 PM Ignore cyclej Report Abuse other plants better than corn. like sugar cane
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jul 7, 2011 7:32:10 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "If we used the corn stalks and other plant cellulose to make the ethanol it would be a fine idea. "That's debatable. You've got land and soil quality issues to deal with if stocks are removed over a long term basis. "But, since when did we get any fine ideas out of washington." The idea came from private investors pooling a few hundred thousand dollars to build a facility to make ethanol from a dirt cheap US raw material (corn). "We give the big corporations a huge susidy for making ethanol out of corn." And exactly which subsidy would that be? Oil companies pay a lower tax rate on fuel containing ethanol. There is no subsidy for making ethanol from corn. "The price of corn is going up and raising the cost of other food. " Get your pencil out and use your head. The price of corn has almost nothing to do with the price of your food. the price of oil, on the other hand, does. "The poor taxpayer is taking it in the rear no matter which way we turn." How is the taxpayer "taking it in the rear"? When oil companies distribute ethanol, they pay less tax on the profit. The more fuel on the market and the less tax the oil companies pay means you the consumer pays less for fuel. "It ought to be against the law to burn food. " Can't wait to live in your Marxist utopia.
gas2low2011 Rookie Author Indianapolis Posts:1 Points:120 Joined:Jul 2011	Message Posted: Jul 6, 2011 1:12:26 PM Ignore gas2low2011 Report Abuse If we used the corn stalks and other plant cellulose to make the ethanol it would be a fine idea. But, since when did we get any fine ideas out of washington. We give the big corporations a huge susidy for making ethanol out of corn. The price of corn is going up and raising the cost of other food. The poor taxpayer is taking it in the rear no matter which way we turn. It ought to be against the law to burn food.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jul 6, 2011 4:57:31 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "Actually I didn't know that. I am not saying you are wrong, just that... Where did you find that info?" The Environmental Working Group website. It is one of the most ANTI AG groups in the US. This is not one of the facts they like to highlight, so you have to dig for it. But, it is there. You have to search on individual farmers and landowners or look at regions. But, the trend is obvious: The USDA website also publicizes number of acres in the CRP program and the price support base. CRP acres are decreasing and the price support for corn and beans is well below the current market price. The USDA also describes how these programs work. In general, ag subsidies are the inverse of production. That is if market demand is high, no subsidies get paid out. I also own cropland in Iowa. These payments are a routine part of the market dynamics for landowners and farmers. My CRP contracts will expire in three years. I will place that land in hay production, which directly means no subsidies for me and indirectly more land available elsewhere for corn and bean production.
thuathienhue Champion Author Michigan Posts:3,584 Points:659,915 Joined:Jul 2011	Message Posted: Jul 6, 2011 2:32:24 AM Ignore thuathienhue Report Abuse geoag2 had a good idea; but does the US produce enough sugar cane. Sure they are doing that also in thailand, as they have E85 fuel. Haven't seen E-85 in VietNam yet.
goldseeker Champion Author West Virginia Posts:19,755 Points:2,746,515 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2011 11:08:19 PM Ignore goldseeker Report Abuse geoag02: It is common knowledge that when market prices are up, subsidies are down. I cannot tell you exactly how much reduction there has been for price support for corn. The last I heard was about 8 billion per year. There is a support price that varies somewhat from region to region for ag crops. This may even vary from country to county. Therefore it is very hard to come up with a total figure. When I lived and worked on a grain farm some 20 years ago, the market price of corn was $1.90 per bushel. Farmers cannot make a profit off of corn when the market is that low, so price supports kick in. If they did not, then farmers would not continue to raise corn and lose money. The futures market for corn now is around $6.50 per bushel. I can assure you that this is above the price support level. Futures market prices are also not necessarly what a farmer receives. A lot of corn is sold on cash bids and this price is usually lower than futures market prices. Last year the average price received for corn was $3.83. It is very likely that this years crop will come in at a market value in the range of $4.50 - $6.50. I that does indeed hold true, then it is unlikely that price supports will kick in. Now there is other types of support that has nothing to do with the current commodity market. For instance crop insurance. Due to heavy rains and spring and early summer flooding some farmers were not able to plant crops, so they could file for crop insurance which will help to offset their loss. They also could have a partial loss due to hail or wind. Or reduce yield due to many different causes which would also qualify them for crop insurance. I personally do not consider crop insurance as a subsidy. Others may disagree.
geoag02 All-Star Author Dallas Posts:843 Points:177,970 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2011 9:14:53 PM Ignore geoag02 Report Abuse >>"You know darned well that ethanol production has helped reduce ag subsidies by tens of billions of dollars." Actually I didn't know that. I am not saying you are wrong, just that... Where did you find that info?
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2011 9:18:06 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "If what you say is true, then why are taxpayers forced to subsidize corn? " It's real difficult for you to be intellectually honest, isn't it Shockjock. You know darned well that ethanol production has helped reduce ag subsidies by tens ob fillions of dollars.
Shockjock1961 Champion Author Illinois Posts:20,375 Points:2,211,885 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Jul 1, 2011 10:35:24 PM Ignore Shockjock1961 Report Abuse "We are Americans. We produce corn for less cost than anyone else in the world." If what you say is true, then why are taxpayers forced to subsidize corn?
GrumpyCat Champion Author Alabama Posts:2,757 Points:810,570 Joined:Jun 2009	Message Posted: Jul 1, 2011 8:26:39 PM Ignore GrumpyCat Report Abuse We are Americans. We produce corn for less cost than anyone else in the world. At such low costs that its the cheapest source we have of suitable biomass for ethanol production.
97PearlCat Champion Author Tulsa Posts:4,108 Points:861,370 Joined:Dec 2010	Message Posted: Jun 30, 2011 4:42:16 PM Ignore 97PearlCat Report Abuse Farm lobby.
Shockjock1961 Champion Author Illinois Posts:20,375 Points:2,211,885 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Jun 28, 2011 1:34:40 PM Ignore Shockjock1961 Report Abuse Iowa Caucuses and the Corn Lobby...
tomintx All-Star Author Dallas Posts:744 Points:80,235 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Jun 28, 2011 12:58:18 PM Ignore tomintx Report Abuse Why Corn Ethanol? "Iowa Caucuses" Period.
krzysiek_ck Champion Author Illinois Posts:5,500 Points:756,835 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Jun 28, 2011 12:04:56 PM Ignore krzysiek_ck Report Abuse In Europe the liquid propane is commonly used.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jun 28, 2011 8:44:09 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "Why not concentrate on natural gas, which this country has an abundance of, or hydrogen?" Because, the distribution system is for liquid fuels, like gasoline and ethanol. Why not use natural gas to distill ethanol and double the energy value of the natural gas? Hydrogen is abundant, but not in a reduced state. Guess what the most economical source of hydrogen is today; crude oil and natural gas. Todays ethanol producers are making a product that is competitive with gasoline. Abut 13 billion gallons a year. That's significant. It is these companies that are making ethanol from corn today, that are developing the processes to make ethanol from waste tomorrow.
chemist74 Champion Author Cleveland Posts:13,510 Points:2,395,980 Joined:Apr 2005	Message Posted: Jun 28, 2011 8:32:31 AM Ignore chemist74 Report Abuse Geoag02 - In the U.S., the emphasis is on ethanol rather than vegetable oils like soybean oil because most people here drive gasoline vehicles not diesels. Vegetable oils are a starting material for biodiesel, not gasoline. Brazil makes almost all of their ethanol from cane sugar, not cellulose. Ethanol from cellulose is still more expensive. The U.S. does not grow much sugar cane so there is not much cane sugar or cane cellulose available domestically. Many people in the U.S. are trying to get the cost low enogh for cellulosic ethanol to compete economically with ethanol from corn. When it get cheap enough, cellulosic ethanol will probably replace ethanol from corn.
wvsalerx Rookie Author West Virginia Posts:5 Points:2,295 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Jun 27, 2011 5:26:52 AM Ignore wvsalerx Report Abuse I have read many of the posts and here are some points to consider/ponder. Why do we want plant based fuels? Their efficiency, when you look at cost of production and mileage return, is very poor. Why not concentrate on natural gas, which this country has an abundance of, or hydrogen? Why not lower our use of fuels all together. Cut back on unnecessary trips. How much does it cost the American taxpayer each time one of our elected officials takes a trip to another state or country? Airplanes don't fly cheap and they are even more expensive to fly only a handfull of people. Some have referneced farmers and overuse of fertilizer and chemicals; all of these require a crude product to either produce or transport. Farmers are no different than any other business, they are trying to become more efficient with less. In the US the number of acres to farm decreases anually, so they are producing more product on fewer acres. I think it is time for each of us to try to do the same.
Androspi Rookie Author Dallas Posts:4 Points:180 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 4:54:23 PM Ignore Androspi Report Abuse As long as is cheap I'll go with ethanol.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 4:52:28 PM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "Ah, American subsidies going to provide "competitively priced" fuels for consumers overseas... " Do you have a clue at to what you are talking about or are you just insinuating, again.
Shockjock1961 Champion Author Illinois Posts:20,375 Points:2,211,885 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 3:41:26 PM Ignore Shockjock1961 Report Abuse "Almost all of Brazil's imports were U.S. corn-based ethanol, as prices were deemed to be the world's most competitive." Ah, American subsidies going to provide "competitively priced" fuels for consumers overseas...
tropicalmn Sophomore Author Minnesota Posts:182 Points:157,165 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 1:49:20 PM Ignore tropicalmn Report Abuse Currently the best way to make ethanol is sugar cane in Brazil,the best way in the heartland of the USA is corn ethanol.Sugar cane is only grown in Florida ,Louisiana,Texas and I believe now only the Hawaiian island of Maui. Brazil, the world's ethanol superpower, has had to import unprecedented volumes of the bio fuel from December of 2010 through March of 2011. Due to a culmination of factors – an insufficient 2010 harvest, weak expectations for the 2011 growing season and booming domestic demand – Brazil imported an estimated 80 to 200 million liters (21.1 to 52.9 million gallons) of ethanol during the first quarter of 2011.Almost all of Brazil's imports were U.S. corn-based ethanol, as prices were deemed to be the world's most competitive. [Edited by: tropicalmn at 6/24/2011 2:52:15 PM EST]
AccordV6MN Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:4,402 Points:672,460 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 11:28:28 AM Ignore AccordV6MN Report Abuse soybean is use to make bio-diesel, easier to make to rather than ethanol. just like corn is easier to be converted to ethanol than bio-diesel. the best way to make make ethanol is from sugar cane just like brazil that has millions of acres of sugar cane field. nice comparison b/w brazil and USA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol_fuel_in_Brazil scroll down and look at the table in land usage and production output, etc..
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Jun 24, 2011 6:05:09 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "The majority of Ethanol produced in Brazil is Switch Grass." No, it's not. The large scale commercial process to produce ethanol from grass does not exist yet. They use sugar cane.
lj92359 Rookie Author Texas Posts:1 Points:870 Joined:Nov 2007	Message Posted: Apr 30, 2011 1:09:51 PM Ignore lj92359 Report Abuse The majority of Ethanol produced in Brazil is Switch Grass. /article.cfm?id=grass-makes-better-ethanol-than-corn
Donatelo Champion Author Dayton Posts:1,168 Points:307,705 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Apr 19, 2011 6:28:02 PM Ignore Donatelo Report Abuse we should be using natural gas in all diesel engines. we have vast natural gas reserves. that would save one third of the oil we use and that money would stay here.
paulp24 Champion Author Harrisburg Posts:4,681 Points:849,800 Joined:Dec 2010	Message Posted: Apr 18, 2011 1:39:49 PM Ignore paulp24 Report Abuse Unfortunately only corn has an effective lobbyist. There are much better ways of making it with waste byproducts.
RHNA1997 Veteran Author New Jersey Posts:299 Points:65,140 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2011 11:05:43 PM Ignore RHNA1997 Report Abuse they will never use it.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2011 8:40:30 PM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse Go for it, ceman11. If you can develop the process to make ethanol from orange peals, you will win the Nobel prize. Until then, corn remains the best option.
iceman11 Champion Author Ontario Posts:2,715 Points:536,425 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2011 8:17:50 PM Ignore iceman11 Report Abuse corn is not the answer orange peels for an juice factory is the way
ivanox Rookie Author Miami Posts:9 Points:3,000 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2011 7:36:14 PM Ignore ivanox Report Abuse I lover ethanol
rededdew Rookie Author Tampa Posts:20 Points:36,805 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2011 3:50:58 PM Ignore rededdew Report Abuse What about orange peels from orange juice processing
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 9:59:06 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse She can read. If she gets enough letters, she will pay attention. You can also do your part in decreasing ag subsidies by using the products. Most of the subsidies are inversely proportional to market demand. If market prices are high, NO PRICE SUPPORTS are paid. If demand for grain is high more corn and beans will be planted. When that happens, ground comes out of CRP to grow grain and other crops. That's the fastest way to decrease subsidies, and you don't even have to write your congressman. If you doubt what I am saying, read the ag bills. It's in black and white.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 9:55:39 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse Your subsidy example is a good one. Why not show who the top 10 are? It makes it a little better to understand when the 7 figure price comes out, instead of a small 6 figure.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 9:50:41 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse You can ask Michelle Bachmann that question. I am sure she is not for getting rid of them, so it does no good to write to her.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 9:41:05 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "I am saying, get rid of the subsidys. What problem do you see with that?" Not a thing. I'm all for getting rid of subsidies. That I agree with you 100%. However, once these programs are gone, you need to be prepared for wild swings in market prices. When that happens, you will see expensive food. It's comical to hear people whine about high food prices. All US grain is dirt cheap and represents a single digit fraction of your food dollar. If you read the early farm bills of the 30s, 40s, and 50s, they spell out what they were intended for: maintain stable markets and conserve ag land. I would much rather see wider swings in market prices. Furthermore, individual land owners do a much better job of preserving their expensive land than do government programs. 69mustang, it's obvious you have a strong opinion on the subject. But, like most people, you really don't understand the programs. That's understandable, they are complex. So, read the bills. Find out just what they do. Then, write your congressman to ax all the programs.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 9:18:46 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse I am saying, get rid of the subsidys. What problem do you see with that? Its just another form of welfare for you. If you can't make it, then maybe you need to be looking for a different job, sell the farm to a corporate farm, and join the rest of us in the work force. Profit? Why didn't you just come out an say it? Don't beat around the bush about it. You want more money, because your life style needs to be upgraded. [Edited by: 69mustang at 4/5/2011 10:21:09 AM EST]
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 6:53:33 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse "Why don't you just say it? You take the CRP land out, and you can grow more corn," It is disgusting that some people would actually farm for a profit. "and thus exhausting the soil so it has to be over fertilized so it can grow a grow. Just keep your hand out for the government dole." Why would you think farmers would destroy a valuable asset by applying an expensive chemical beyond what was needed to grow corn? "Just read what some of those farmers are getting," I do. My name is on the list. My neighbors names are on the list. And if you would take time to read what I posted, Ag subsidies, especially the ones related to corn, are dramatically down, since the market for corn has improved. "You must think were all being dumbed down.:( " From your comments, obviously so.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 12:28:50 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse I shouldn't of called them all farmers, my mistake. Corporate land owners is more the term. Anything for a buck. Farmers take care of the land, but the big buys out on the dole, just see more money, more money. I laughed when we had 2 guys that tried to outdo each other. One would buy a farm, and the next guy had to buy a farm. Just had to be the biggest to get their name in the ag news. They both came to a befitting end. They both lost everything. Just to damn greedy.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2011 12:21:35 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse Why don't you just say it? You take the CRP land out, and you can grow more corn, just like you say you can get more bushels out of an acre than you could 40 years ago. Any guess why? You went from 40 inch rows, down to 12, so ya, you put more seed into the same plot of land, and thus exhausting the soil so it has to be over fertilized so it can grow a grow. Just keep your hand out for the government dole. Just read what some of those farmers are getting, plus look up alot of congressmen and see what the government is paying them, on top of their salaries. You must think were all being dumbed down.:(
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2011 7:07:42 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse Thanks for posting that link 69mustang. I'll use it to illustrate the point I have been making: Subsidies to farmers have been DECREASING since ethanol production has been INCREASING. Here's a group that farms thousands of acres. Therir commodity subsidies, just like every other farmer in the US, have decreased tenfold since demand for grain has increased. Look at the trend since 2005, when ethanol production took off. Subsidy example In addition to the crop subsidies, we will start to see a decrease in CRP subsidies. There are, typically, 10 to 15 year contracts. Demand for grass products is up. It now makes sense to not renew the crp contract and harvest grass, alfalfa, clover, alternating with a nitrogen fixing crop like soybeans, where possible. Like I have been saying ethanol is decreasing net subsidies paid out by the government. EG the net decrease in ag subsidies is greater than the tax credits paid out to oil companies to sell ethanol.
69mustang Champion Author Minnesota Posts:9,380 Points:1,420,910 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2011 12:24:45 AM Ignore 69mustang Report Abuse Just ask how many have their hand out for the government subsidy check, and you will find the answer. If you want to lower how much the government owes, as so many are blasting this administration, they should start right there. http://farm.ewg.org
goldseeker Champion Author West Virginia Posts:19,755 Points:2,746,515 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Apr 3, 2011 9:14:41 AM Ignore goldseeker Report Abuse tropicalmn, ethanol producers also extract corn oil from the distillers grains. Corn oil can be produced as food grade or fuel grade which can easily be converted into biodiesel.
GM1954 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,950 Points:131,880 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Apr 3, 2011 8:29:55 AM Ignore GM1954 Report Abuse tropicalmn, posted some great statistics. Corn has one major advantage over almost all other ethanol precursors. When the corn is processed into ethanol, more animal feed is produced than is ethanol. On a weight basis, more distillers grains (high protein animal feed) is made. Almost two tons per acer, as a matter of fact. There's nothing that comes close to corn for making ethanol. High ethanol yield and high food yield, at the same time. Even at today's higher prices, it remains a dirt cheap commodity.
aRBy Veteran Author Grand Rapids Posts:454 Points:302,550 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Apr 1, 2011 7:19:21 PM Ignore aRBy Report Abuse Oils derived from agricultural products work in diesel engines. I would like to see more production of dimethyl ether. Dimethyl ether is a derivative of methanol but can most easily be refined from natural gas. Producing biodiesel from agricultural oils seems to have a bigger impact on food supply than corn ethanol. However, the production of dimethyl ether from methanol and/or natural gas seems to circumvent this issue. I'm just throwing this out there for discussion. I don't know how much any of you have studied the potential of dimethyl ether as a diesel fuel substitute.
geoag02 All-Star Author Dallas Posts:843 Points:177,970 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 30, 2011 6:33:20 PM Ignore geoag02 Report Abuse Thanks tropicalmn for all the numbers. That's exactly the kind of answer that I was hoping for.
tropicalmn Sophomore Author Minnesota Posts:182 Points:157,165 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Mar 29, 2011 8:40:44 PM Ignore tropicalmn Report Abuse from U of Missouri Biofuel conversion factors (approximate, from various sources): 1 acre harvested of corn in 2012: 158.6 bushels of corn per acre 2.77 gallons of ethanol per bushel of corn 439 gallons of ethanol per acre 1 acre harvested of sugar beets harvested in 2012: 23 tons of beets per acre 24 gallons of ethanol per ton of beets 552 gallons of ethanol per acre 1 acre of harvested soybeans in 2012 42.8 bushels of soybeans per acre 11.28 pounds of soybean oil per bushel of soybeans 7.7 pounds of unrefined soybean oil per gallon of biodiesel 63 gallons of biodiesel per acre 1 acre of harvested canola in 2012 1557 pounds of canola per acre 0.383 pounds of canola oil per pound of canola 7.7 pounds of unrefined canola oil per gallon of biodiesel 77 gallons of biodiesel per acre 1 At likely prices in 2012, feedstock costs of corn per gallon of ethanol would be much lower than feedstock costs of vegetable oil per gallon of biodiesel(about half) or of sugar per gallon of ethanol. 2 Even though canola oil can produce more biodiesel per acre, canola oil tends to sell for more than soybean oil in this country. Thus, soybean oil is likely to be the favored oil for U.S. biodiesel production. [Edited by: tropicalmn at 3/29/2011 9:41:49 PM EST]
Gypsy_tech All-Star Author Minnesota Posts:538 Points:15,675 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Mar 29, 2011 11:02:16 AM Ignore Gypsy_tech Report Abuse When cellulosic based ethanol plants come online then you'll see many other sources used. Like hemp maybe. LOL then we'd have other problems besides the drinking of the fuel thing.
chemist74 Champion Author Cleveland Posts:13,510 Points:2,395,980 Joined:Apr 2005	Message Posted: Mar 28, 2011 3:06:15 PM Ignore chemist74 Report Abuse Vegetable oils like soybean oil are easy to convert to a diesel fuel replacement but these product are not volatile enough for gasoline replacements so they would need much more extemsive and expensive processing to produce a gasoline replacement. The main problem with cellulosic ethanol is that it is currently much more expensive than ethanol from corn or sugar cane. most of the ethanol in Brazil is made from cane sugar, not from the cellulose in the left over cane.